Something a littel fishy here?

Moderators: Jason8472, Casious

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Jason8472
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Post by Jason8472 » Wed Nov 19, 2003 6:46 am

Hmmm. I did invite them to join in our thread, but I didnt think it would come to this kind of crap. Yet another blemish in the modding community.

I was going to post something in regards to how I was rude and childish at their forum, but, alas, the thread there is closed. I have already emailed Geezer and explained myself thoroughly. Im sure we both have a better understanding of the occurance.
"Better to keep your mouth shut and have the world believe you a fool than to open it and confirm their belief."

Space: Above and Beyond: Homeworld

Merc
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Post by Merc » Wed Nov 19, 2003 7:42 am

Indeed. It's a good thing that thread was closed.

[ 19. November 2003, 06:48 AM: Message edited by: Merc ]

an0n
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Post by an0n » Wed Nov 19, 2003 2:16 pm

Originally posted by Black Wolf:
Swooh leads to Geezersoft, which in turn leads to the current site.
Really? Huh. Cool.

And on a related note: Krackers, you retard. There's a difference between flexing your intellectual and moral superiority using witty, scathing remarks to anger and demoralise your opposition; And using bad grammar and spelling to make them laugh at you.

As much as my opinion of this mod has plummeted during this little spate of inter-communal bitching, my belief that Krackers is not an AOL-Tard™ has spiral much further into the darkness of the abyss.

Learn. To. Fucking. Punctuate.

*goes to do 'stuff'*

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Crook
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Post by Crook » Wed Nov 19, 2003 3:11 pm

Ahh I feel your pain all round. I remember the armada fiasco with models of mine. I've never understood the idea behind converting other peoples models anyway - modeling is so much fun it's better to do it yourself, but lazy modders are only out for the kudos it seems.

It is simply good manners to ask for permission. Most of the time you'd get it, but if you don't theres no need to cry. If you are a mod team you have modelers. Use them.

Also, this topic is close to my heart. If anyone wants any help, just ask and I'm up for it.

Shame it had to happen to SAAB - the amount of mods is small as it is, and to bring them all together would have been a good thing. It's dickheads like Krackers87 (a 13 yr old perhaps? It'd suprise me if she was older) who give the idea of modding and art a bad name. And since he doesn't care about messing up his work, if anyone want's to begin DoS attacking his site I'm sure he wouldn't mind! He he.....

What people like that fail to recognise is respect and right. Artists have a right to have their work respected. Even a disclaimer or EULA etc etc is not necessary to protect your intellectual copyright. Unfortunately some hold the mistaken belief that the internet is somehow a 'free for all', and that if any material is on the net, it's public domain.

They are, of course, wrong.

[ 19. November 2003, 02:12 PM: Message edited by: Crook ]

an0n
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Post by an0n » Wed Nov 19, 2003 4:01 pm

Originally posted by Crook:
Artists have a right to have their work respected.
You do, of course, realise the irony?

EDIT: And as for DoS'ing his server, it's actually one of Swooh's. And while I realise it was (probably) a joke, I feel I should note that while Stealth is a complete technical-fuckhead, I do believe he has sufficient sk1llz and malice to retaliate.

[ 19. November 2003, 03:06 PM: Message edited by: an0n ]

Flipside
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Post by Flipside » Wed Nov 19, 2003 7:24 pm

Ok, I'm going to get this off my chest, because I won't be posting in here again.
If you don't want DG using the models, fine, fair enough, that's your perogative, and you are entitled to it. I don't think that is a very good community spirit, but then you seem to be of the opinion that 'community spirit' is everyone falling over and begging for forgiveness for a mistake until the end of time.
Secondly, on top of that, if you have something to say to DG, then say it to him, do NOT go onto his home board and start attacking people who have worked hard to help the modding community in general, what have you done for anyone but yourselves and your own mod lately? And no Jason, you are not 'direct' or 'straight talking' you are rude, pure and simple.
I like Homeworld, and I have enjoyed some of the MODS, though I won't be playing this one. Next time you want to deny someone permission to use your models, please at least attempt to show some maturity to somebody who accidentally used your models without knowing, you can scream till you are blue in the face that he should have checked, and perhaps he should, but to be so belligerent and selfish about it is, quite frankly, embarrasing.
I hope your MOD goes well, and that you complete it soon, but just try to bear in mind that sometimes people make mistakes, unless you are all faultless, and that the mature approach is to deal with it subtly, considerately and in private.

So, at the end of the day, the matter of the models is between you and DG, however, please don't go onto other forums and start hurling insulting comments at the members, if you consider this being a community, you are sorely mistaken.

Flipside.

P.S. Someone will reply 'Yawn' since this seems to be the entire reply when someone hits a sore spot with you.

[ 19. November 2003, 06:25 PM: Message edited by: Flipside ]

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Jason8472
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Post by Jason8472 » Wed Nov 19, 2003 7:55 pm

No, I was not rude. And I didnt insult anyone at your forum.

I can live with that. Like I said before, I did email Geezer and Im sure we are both on the same page now. Im just waiting for a reply from him.

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Post by Merc » Wed Nov 19, 2003 8:30 pm

Just show me how in his 2 posts how he insulted EVERYBODY on your board. And DG accidentally used our mesh. Ummmm...no. The fact is he had our model with textures changed in his screenshots section of his webpage. No credits...no text saying it was not his. We came upon this and wanted to know what the deal was. All of your long winded posts saying the same thing will not change this fact.

I have talked to DG, everything is cool on both of our ends. I suggest you all drop it now.

[ 19. November 2003, 07:34 PM: Message edited by: Merc ]

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Crook
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Post by Crook » Wed Nov 19, 2003 8:50 pm

Originally posted by an0n:
You do, of course, realise the irony?
I would, if there were any. Try to distinguish between artist and fool maybe?

As to keeping it in private - I disagree entirely. These things should be as public as possible in the appropriate place - the forum in question. It affects the entire community that they might be using stolen (not 'used by mistake' - no-one buys that, sorry) material, and I for one would want to know what's going on.

Keeping it behind closed doors is just saving the developer from much needed humbling embarassment - a deterrant from it happening again in the future.


Edit: Just noticed this too:

To sum up Jake, I've apologized again and again, and as requested I've taken down the screenshot. But I'm begging you - on my knees begging you - to allow me to use your skins and model. Without them this mod project is dead and six months or work wasted since I simply cannot create skins of that quality myself and no-one else will help me to that extent. Please, as one SAABer to another, find it in your heart to accept my apology and lend me the resources. As compensation for my crime I'll quite happily share with your team the modifications I'm making to the carrier model (you might just like the new uberised version).


The apology was well made, but you don't steal a neighbours lawnmower and when you get caught say "Oh! Can I use it anyway?"

This might sound odd but, if you can't model and/or texture to this quality, don't you think you should learn? And until you learn, don't you think you should NOT be modding? Modding and modeling is for talented people see. Get the talent, then do the mod. When I started, I was a complete PC newbie... same for everyone by definition, and you can't sidestep the learning curve. Who would want to??

If you want to learn, there are a million places to get the information from. The help is there if you need it. ASK. If you just want the glory, then you're just too lazy.


Edit #2: The thread IS most certainly locked on the 'other side', but reading through it I'm amazed at some posters attitudes. They clearly have no strong idea about 'intellectual copyright'. If you've come over here for a read, please go away and read about intellectual copyright (most especially pertaining to digital material) right away. Most statements on this topic in that thread were just plain wrong.

[ 19. November 2003, 08:21 PM: Message edited by: Crook ]

Coyote
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Post by Coyote » Wed Nov 19, 2003 10:24 pm

Jason: Need to work on those social skills, young man. If you really don't see how you were being rude, I recommend you get away from the computer for a while, presuming that the actual, you know, fresh air won't kill you after so many years of inexposure. And in the meantime I'd advise you stop trying to serve as the spokesman for your community to the rest of the modding universe- you're pretty poor at it. Not even inventive at being an arsehole, for shame.

And- is that an invitation to cause a, shall we say, more entertaining scene here that I see? I'm game- I don't materially represent either side, I'm free to do as I please. I'm minding my manners for the moment because, after all, that's the nice thing to do when you're on someone else's board, but I can stop if you ask nicely. May want to talk that over with your little buddies here, though, first.


Crook: I am fully aware of intellectual copyright laws and how they pertain here. But even assuming you were willing to attempt to drag this into court (heh, I can see that case), you have no real rights here. It was not copyrighted in advance, neither party is profiting from the resource, there is no organized group on the other end of the line, and you all left it open for anyone who wanted it to take and provided no EULA or anything of the sort; you have no case. Yeah, it's a nice word to throw around, but in the end it's like threatening to get your imaginary big brother to beat him up. Bad form, old chap, especially since the rest of your posts are far and away more reasoned than the rest of what I've seen by you lot.

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