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The Gaming Union • View topic - Hw2 campaign shiplist (beta) Updated 26th May 2004

Hw2 campaign shiplist (beta) Updated 26th May 2004

Moderators: Darth1o9, Calavan, Dilber

Postby Turgidson » Sat Apr 24, 2004 5:27 pm

AFAIK, the current HW2 end battle log file is crappy, as it won't give us exactly which unit types died - they only give use number of built/destroyed ships. This ain't enough, but scripting might allow us to output much more precise end of game stats.
Other possibility might be to force the game to save at end battle, and retrieve the needed stats from that savefile. Prolly quite complex, but I hope it'll be doable.

HW2 battles will prolly be made by a coded generator. The file format is known, so we'll prolly be able to do (or, at least, should try to do) what, after all, Bern previously did with EvR app.


As for my post : the problem is that, IMHO, we're already going in the details (= shiplists) without even having made a real concept. IMHO, we shall first define :
- global combat doctrine for NR, GE, and perhaps other sides, which will be translated into the technology (= shiplist)
- ensure that all these doctrines (can) make sense, and that all these doctrines (can) allow all sides to have decent winning chances
- define how much freedom the players have at defining their own doctrines, from the shiplist
- define what kind of evolutions (retrofits, mid-life upgrades...) are allowed
- define our stance towards fan-made stuff, "canon" stuff, about units themselves but also their stats
- and so on...

That's a lot of stuff, and I really think it's premature to already post a shiplist in hard rock.

As Nick explained, SW is an universe that primarily focuses on single heroes/single units (Luke, Leia, Han, Vader, the Emperor, the Millenium Falcon, Rogue Squadron...), and rarely focuses on strategy itself. Yavin and Endor were not won by the Alliance, but lost by the clumsyness on the Empire (weak point in the DS, but "we don't care it's invincible", and lots of strong mistakes at Endor (why so few stormies to retake the ground base ?) as well as lucky shots (A-Wing right into Executor's external bridge)). I'm not even counting the globally lower tech of the Alliance in the EU, or the superweapons of the EU.
In a RPG, we can assume these elements (at least, partly), and after all, RPG are focusing on heroes.
In a strat game, we can't assume that one side will be dumb enough to give the other side decent chances of winning it. That's why SW can't be taken raw for a strat game, but needs at least some reworking. After all, Lucasarts DID add ships that were never seen before for the Rebellion/Supremacy game.

As for my piss-mode post, it's because I had the (wrong) feeling some people could want to avoid discussion and impose their views (as had been shown in much older posts, but prolly it was irony I didn't get). It seems that I was wrong, and I'm happy I was. End of that part here.
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Postby Darth1o9 » Fri Apr 30, 2004 12:29 am

actually turg eville was the one that suggested that the log would be useful to use, however he is going to see if their is something he can do and also he said their will be a gco mode which should be cool :D

*EDIT* i thought we had gone though all this, we have a basic setup which has been posted and agreed upon along time ago, who controls what planets, we have a basic mod that will include the above ships so i dont know why you are the only problem who actually has a problem

just in case you cant find the topic that has been made sticky [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[size="1"][ 30. April 2004, 03:19 AM: Message edited by: Darth1o9 ][/size]
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Postby insecttoid3 » Fri Apr 30, 2004 3:58 am

Pirate Shiplist (open for debate and subject to change, etc etc)

Fighters

Z-95 Headhunter
R-41 Starchaser
T-Wing
Y-Wing
X-Wing
Skipray Blastboat
Cloakshape Fighter
TIE Fighter
Tri-Wing Ugly (Clutch)(TIE cockpit with 3 solar panel wings)
Deathseed Ugly (chir'daki)(TIE cockpit with X-Wing wings)
X-TIE Ugly (X-Wing cockpit with TF Wings)
TIE-Wing Ugly (Die-Wing)(TIE cockpit with Y-Wing engines)

Capships

Corellian Gunship
Corellian Corvette
Pirate Corellian Action VI Bulk Freighter (heavily armed with turbolasers)
Marauder Corvette
Bulk Cruiser
Nebulon-B Frigate
Kaloth Battlecruiser
Pirate Kaloth Battlecruiser (a large number of turbolasers removed, and a planetary defense ion cannon mounted on the hull)
Dreadnaught Heavy Cruiser
Strike Cruiser
Pirate Strike Cruiser (a large number of turbolasers removed, and 2 planetary defense ion cannons mounted on the hull)

Heavy Capship

Pirate Victory Star Destroyer I (missile launchers removed, and 4-6 planetary defense ion cannons mounted on the hull)

[size="1"][ 30. April 2004, 04:01 AM: Message edited by: insecttoid3 ][/size]
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Postby insecttoid3 » Fri Apr 30, 2004 4:26 am

a note about the mounted ions:


planetary ions require alot of power,
more than a ship can supply to fire the same way a planet can.

a planetary ion mounted on a ship would be less powerful then on a planet, and fire far less often(eg, a minute recharging).

a pair of pirate strk witht heir twin pln ions each could temporarily disable an isd with an ion barage, and alow the rest of the pirate fleet to escape.

that is one of the main purposes of those ions.

the main reason is to disable freighters for easy boarding, the second is to disable capships to allow fleeing. pirates are not built for full scale capital warfare, they are built to run.
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Postby Darth1o9 » Fri Apr 30, 2004 4:40 am

nice job mate, now we need some models dude
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Postby insecttoid3 » Fri Apr 30, 2004 4:57 am

the corellioan action 6, and all the uglies but the deathseed have all been in previous versions of swnr.

we might be able to convert them to hw2 and use them if we get permission, or something.
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Postby Darth1o9 » Fri Apr 30, 2004 5:44 am

well unless we can get some new models made
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Postby Turgidson » Thu May 27, 2004 1:52 pm

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Postby Darth1o9 » Thu May 27, 2004 7:58 pm

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Postby nickersonm » Thu May 27, 2004 8:28 pm

He assumed nothing. If you actually bother to read his post, you'll notice that he says "I think that if the MC120 is more powerful than the Strident/Viscount, then the MC120 ...". Meaning that if it is, then his sentence applies. As he does not know what it is (neither do I), he asked, and then presented a response if it turned out to be one way. You simply attacked part of his post, after incorrectly reading it, and did not even bother to answer his question.

- nickersonm

[size="1"][ 27. May 2004, 08:29 PM: Message edited by: nickersonm ][/size]
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